Mod Post: So let's talk about this ableism thing.

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Disclaimer: After writing this, I sent it to the other mods and some friends of mine to check to make sure it didn't say anything problematic, but if they or I missed something important or said something wrong, please don't hesitate to let me know. I'm still learning.

Something's been brought to our attention in regards to language people have been using re: disability, and problematic depictions thereof. It's great that we have a character in this fandom who is disabled, and it's great that there is a lot of interest in writing about him! But there are people on this meme who are also disabled, and insensitive or simply ignorant words can really hurt them. As our goal with this meme is to maintain a space where everyone present can feel comfortable participating, we'd like to keep this from happening, and we hope you feel the same way.

You may have noticed that "ableism" has been added to the list of triggers to warn for. If you're not familiar with the word, it refers to any speech, action, or treatment that hurts, oppresses, or discriminates against disabled people. Words like "cripple" and "gimp" fall into this category. Prompts using these words (with a few exceptions, noted below) will be deleted. So do stories that depict Charles' disability as disgusting or unacceptable, or erase it completely. Language like “the crippled man”, “the disabled man”, and “the handicapped man” focuses on his disability, perpetuating the common mindset that disabled people are only disabled, and never have any other defining traits.

Now, we're not going to ask you to stop writing these stories, because this is a kink meme and it is not our business what you choose to ask for or write about. But we do ask that you warn for it, if you think your prompt or fill contains it. Wanting stories about Charles and Erik having acrobatic post-movie sex does not make you a bad person, but that doesn't really matter to someone with a disability who reads it and is hurt by that erasure. Taking the time to consider if your content could hurt someone is just the considerate thing to do.

Likewise, it’s entirely possible to write about ableism without taking part in it yourself -- for instance, depicting Charles dealing with being visibly different for the first time and showing the ways people treat him. Unless they are part of the prompt (“someone calls Charles a “cripple”, cue him defending himself/the team defending him”), ableist slurs are unnecessary; comments in which the prompter casually uses them to refer to a character are unacceptable. But no matter how you write about it, any ableist content needs a warning.

The mods will treat this as any other warning issue: if we see ableist language or actions in your fill or prompt (or it's called to our attention by someone else) and there is no warning, we will ask you to post it again with that warning and delete the offending prompt or fill. We'd rather not do this, so please just be aware of what you're writing so that we can all enjoy this meme.

Please also be aware that we are not perfect; if you find unwarned-for ableist content that we haven’t caught, please feel free to contact the poster or us about it.

So to clarify: I am asking you to either change your wordings or warn for your content. Not because of politics or what bothers you, but because this is a space for everyone to enjoy their kinks and it's courteous to let people know that you've written content that might upset them.

And appended: took "crazy" out of the post because it's not that relevant to the discussion and I was informed that lumping mental and physical disabilities together was a bit insensitive, which, yes, I see now. I am leaving the computer for a while; if I don't get to replying to you in a timely fashion, that's why.

One more edit. Someone suggested having a "choose not to warn" option. Is this something people can agree on/ are interested in? It's not ideal but it seems like a good compromise so that we can all get back to the meme. 

Comments

RE:Mod Post

[(Anonymous)]

Hi,
So I've just read this post and the ensuing comments and I was wondering if we can just get some clarification? It just seems like the mods are saying they will delete post that don't warn about "ableism" yet ableism has not been clearly defined and understood (at least objectively) by the mods. Its confusing because, as the mod have stated, people don't recognize when their being offensive and simply having someone say its offensive is obviously not enough as this is a kink meme and virtually everything can be offensive. My deal is just that if my fic does not have Charles in a wheelchair I think it can be assumed that its alternate universe or takes place before the Divorce, or at very least my labeling it as AU is a sufficient enough warning. I mean this is kind of like if I as a women were offended by Charles/Erik shippers because he needs to be with Moira or if someone made Angel a white male instead of a black female. I think seeing slash, AU, or male!Angel are sufficient warnings in all cases (even if AU is the only warning I get for male!Angel). While I do understand your point in that ableism is something people should be made aware of, I think a kink meme is not the place because fiction is meant to be controversial and kink fiction even moreso. The word "crippled" is still used by prominent authors today to describe the disabled and seeing as X-men: First Class takes place in 1960s where P.C. wasn't even an idea I would not be surprised to see it used casually in a fic. Of course fics where there is blatant hatred/mistreatment towards a disabled person should have warnings, but if they don't I would simply exit out of them and not read them.

Re: Mod Post

[(Anonymous)]

I got a little off-track above. My point was that I would appreciate the mods clearly stating what they want and who will be policing because I would really not want a post of mines deleted. I also think the whole post should be rewritten simply because it is very confusing as is and sounds like the mods want to delete all the fics they deem offensive (even with the add-ons and edits). Yes, I do see that they have edited to an extent but its only really caused confusion and it would be better if they just re-wrote it clearly so people understand what exactly is not allowed and so forth.

Also, I think not allowing unlabeled fics that have Charles walking is clearly censorship because a part of writing and reading anything is taking note of what the author thinks is normal, what he/she thinks is a good plot line, and what he/she thinks her/his audience she be warned of. I think that people who are offended should feel free to comment on it (in a polite manner) or exit out. I don't think it is the author's responsibility to warn for it because the action of warning is in a way censoring, i.e. you really can't warn for offensive descriptions of ableism and not think twice about including it at all, or about the fact that by labeling they are making a point (i.e. by labeling my use of the word "cripple" as offensive I am sending the message that I find all use of the word offensive even if I really don't). This might be the point, to get people thinking about ableism, but that is still placing limitations on people and even coercing them to a point of view. That point of view may or may not be the right one but the thing about free will/speech/thought is that it can go either way.

Re: Mod Post

[(Anonymous)]

Not a mod, obviously, but I think a good rule of thumb is to simply think about whether your prompt/fill has language and/or themes that could be found offensive and think about what warnings you want to apply to it. Granted, yes, it's hard to warn for every possibly offensive thing (because, you're right, it's a kinkmeme, and there's always going to be something that someone could find upsetting or offensive or objectionable), and you can't always predict what will or won't be objectionable to other people. But it doesn't seem to me like the mods are going to indiscriminately delete every prompt or fic that has the word "cripple" in it or depicts Charles as uninjured post-movie - rather, it sounds like they're asking simply that we take some care with our warnings and accept that they may ask us to modify our warnings if they come across something they deem unacceptable.

I understand your concern about policing and censorship, but the thing is that, for some people, reading something offensive is not as simple as "exiting out" and leaving it at that (oh lord, would the internet be a simpler place if it were!). For some, it's not the same as "I don't like slash" or "het really isn't my thing" or even "I'm squicked by noncon," and scrolling past, but that reading a prompt calling Charles a "cripple" or the like can significantly affect the fandom experience. Of course, that's not the case for everyone, and not even the case for all who have a personal connection to Charles's disability. But that's why the mods are not telling anyone what to write or not to write in their prompts/fics, but instead asking that we give a warning for language and themes that might be hurtful to others, just as we would for themes of rape and violence and incest and underage and the like. You're right that there is really no clear cut sense of what is and isn't offensive, and no one should be forced to take a stand on something that they don't agree with, but using a warning along the lines of "may contain objectionable/offensive language" serves well, I think, to cover your bases if you think someone could take offense.

I think the "choose not to warn" idea is a very good compromise, and one that seems to work well in fandom in general - this way, no one is forced to use warnings that they don't agree with or feel could spoil the plot of a story, and those who know themselves to be sensitive to specific themes and language can consider whether to read or not.

I agree that this post is a little clunkily written, but I do appreciate that the mods are open to discussion on this and amending rules as they go. Nothing in fandom is ever perfect, things are always changing and evolving as time goes on, and I think the most important point here is to try and reach a compromise that benefits everyone, that allows everyone to have the best possible experience here. So really, the most important thing here is to just think about how your words might affect someone else and think about the most appropriate warning you can give to others, even if it's "I'm choosing not to warn."

Re: Mod Post

[(Anonymous)]

Hi, I'm the original poster for this comment. Thank you for your reply and I do see your point. I think its just hard for me to get around the idea considering how they phrased it but you are right a "choose" card may be the best solution.

Re: Mod Post

[(Anonymous)]

I can never understand the idea that having to warn is censorship. I'm a writer too, and I just don't understand it. Do you think warning for ableism is censorship, or is it all other warnings too?

You can still write what you want, you just need to write a one line warning for it. I don't even begin to see how writing a warning is coercing the writer into a point of view. Having to write a warning is just being aware that this might trigger someone, or it could be a touchy subject. If a person wants to participate in a community without having awareness at all, then they might want to reconsider what community participation actually involves.

The warning system is not going to be 100% perfect, but nothing in fandom is bulletproof. Not everyone is going to get it right. But to pull out the censorship card here, I think that's stretching the definition of censorship.

Re: Mod Post

[(Anonymous)]

I do see ur point and I think it just how it came out. I'm really base on intent kind of person and with kink memes people usually warn for slash, violence, etc. more for people who want to read that then for people who don't, where as with this warning the intent is not to offend anyone which is just shady territory. I think its censorship in the spirit of the word meaning when rules limit a writers ability to fully express themselves. And a warning does do this especially when it is meant to limit offending people rather than encouraging ppl to read. While I know that we should seek to open minded ppl who try to offend a few, I think that people also deserve to express themselves freely. Mostly, however, the way this subject has been talked strongly suggest that it is wrong to talk about disabilities in a certain manner or give Charles the ability to walk when in actuality this viewpoint lies within a circle of opinion. But, anyway, I agree with person above and think a choose system might work out for the best.

Re: Mod Post

[(Anonymous)]

ayrt

I don't know how to address all the other things about censorship (I still disagree with the usage of the word) just because my opinion is simply: Writing a warning does not make you change your mindset, nor does it oppress you.

But I just want to emphasize that for a lot of people, warnings in kinkmemes aren't for people who want to read that subject. I don't know, would it even be called a 'warning' if so? It would be the genre, or the title of the prompt. I play around in two other kinkmemes and a lot of the time, people warn for rape, underage, inappropriate teacher/student relationship, torture, etc so that people can avoid reading that if it's not their cup of tea. I know I use warnings to avoid genres I dislike. I think this fairly different take to what warnings are for might be part of why you feel that way about this subject.

Re: Mod Post

[(Anonymous)]

That is a good point to make about warnings. I guess I have that one person's trash is another's treasures (aka one persons warning is another person's kink) type of mentality. :/ But thnx, glad to have this conversation